Kunlun

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Kunlun

Postby Yue » Wed Dec 05, 2007 9:43 pm

Have any of you ever heard of kunlun spontatneous nei gung? It is known as the fastest path to enlightenment, and it gives you incredible amounts of energy. It is by far the most powerful practice I've ever encountered. This is a link to the book, for any of you who are interested.

http://www.kunlunbliss.com/books.html
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Postby Dvivid » Thu Dec 06, 2007 8:11 am

Tell us more about your personal experience?

Its a nicely designed site...

What is the physical practice?
"Avoid Prejudice, Be Objective in Your Judgement, Be Scientific, Be Logical and Make Sense, Do Not Ignore Prior Experience." - Dr. Yang

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Postby joeblast » Thu Dec 06, 2007 1:07 pm

I dig this practice, I've been doing it a few months now. Its a water-method practice where you're not actively moving qi at all, stuff just happens with the posture. There's a couple different levels of it; I'm still doing level 1 which is a sitting posture with a vertical ball hold and heels raised. Lots of shaking and stuff...it really seems to open you up!
The book is great, short and sweet. They're coming out with a second revision early next year, I think.
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Postby Yue » Thu Dec 06, 2007 1:16 pm

The book is a better authority than I, but alright. The practice consists of three levels, but I only have experience with level one. In level one you sit in a chair and, for step one, imagine yourself on a whie lotus surrounded by blue sky, nothing else. As you inhale, imagine white light going into your nostrils and lighting up the inside of your body. When you exhale, imagine blueish-purple gases leaving your nostrils. After doing this, place your right hand palm-down at about throat level, and place your left hand palm-up at about navel level, as though you are holding a ball. Lift your heels up so only your toes and the balls of your feet touch the ground. Your legs should start bouncing and you should sense things happening, the events varying from person to person. If nothing else then at least the legs should start bouncing within ten minutes, if not then try again another day. You shouldn't do this practice for more than an hour a day. When you are done and ready to stop, mentally repeat "slow down", slowly open your eyes and focus on your environment. Then, place your hands left over right on your navel. Sit like this quietly for no less than twenty minutes. This practice opens channels and removes blockages much faster than small circulation, including the tricky gates. They say: One hour of kunlun is equal to one-hundred years of another practice. If you do this practice, you shouldn't do any practices that lead qi except for small circulation. No grand circulation. There is a forum practically devoted to kunlun that is packed with more experienced practitioners than me, the link to which I am providing below. Damn, this post was LONG.

http://www.thetaobums.com/forums.html
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Postby joeblast » Thu Dec 06, 2007 1:21 pm

:lol: there's just been a lot of people there practicing it and a lot of threads have popped up lately on kunlun. a few months ago there was one or two!
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The Art of Kunlun

Postby abersold » Tue Dec 11, 2007 4:10 pm

Ok its been a long time since I have posted and miss "YMAA Tribe of Balance & Enlightenment:

Kunlun practices are very nice classical cultivation techniques. I had a buddy show me this book during early summer and it has alot of the same pratices found in Kunlun Mountain cultivation practices found in variant versions of Xiang Gong (fragrance practice)~ not to say they are the same thing!

Imo: It would ad just fine to any cultivation system, without alot of
hurdles. Seems to be gaining momentum on west coast. Try it for 100 days, it seems very straight forward & it seems to be the path of least resistance.

G. Abersold
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Postby darth_freak » Wed Dec 12, 2007 5:18 am

what's wrong with grand circulation and that kunlun meditation? :?
"Turn your butt!"
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Postby joeblast » Fri Dec 14, 2007 2:27 pm

Basically they say not to do any other energy moving practices when learning kunlun, at least until you have a solid grasp on the energy it develops. Kinda like you're supposed to do cross legged while learning SC in order to develop the requisite capacity in CV & GV so that your legs dont end up with more capacity than those. That analogy isnt 100% perfect.
When I was first looking into the practice I had asked if MCO would be ok/compatible with kunlun and they gave an answer of basically yes, since that path is pretty much one of the most fundamental, there should be no issue - but once you gain some proficiency with kunlun you likely wont bother doing small circulation practices.
The small amounts of SC I've done since starting kunlun have been tenfold of what I was able to accomplish before. Just my own little bit of experience with it :)
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Postby darth_freak » Sat Dec 15, 2007 5:13 am

@joeblast: so what's your experience with SC? What benefits does it bring?
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Postby joeblast » Sat Dec 15, 2007 9:15 am

SC...my path has been a somewhat winding one, having learned from books and DVDs. When I really got into meditating, I did embryonic breathing for ~5, 8 months with a bit of a focus on longevity breathing (40 second breaths are cool as hell :D ,) tried SC for ~4-6 months or so, couldnt get too much going. Dailies have brought me in and out of practice since, but I was never able to get a heck of a lot going on with just doing SC. I've been practicing about 3½ years. After doing 2 months of kunlun I've got tenfold of the qi sensations I used to. I've actually had this bugger of a stuck spot in my back at gv8-ub18-47 for a few weeks and in the past few days I had an interesting kunlun 'body-orgasm' of sorts and it kinda freed it up...I can now bring the qi back there to the centerline and bring it up to the crown, over to the third eye, and back down the front. It keeps coming back, but now that I can actually do something with the energy when I feel it stick, it really doesnt bother me!
Some of my cross legged I've done since then I can really feel GV & CV energetically. I've also had a couple interesting ni wan point experiences, but I have had those a few times before in my life at certain times...it seems like kunlun tapped that somehow. Actually, that's when I started having a lot more qi sensations, after that first ni wan point experience I had with it.
So in all, I dont know that I have really seen too much benefit from doing small circulation practice. imho its absolutely necessary to know about, but it just didnt bring me too much in the results department, at least not on its own. I've gotten far more benefit from doing 8 brocades than SC. Again, that is my own personal experience and I certainly wouldnt compare myself to any 'norm.' :)

Not that Dr Yang's practices arent solid, I still rely very much on them and his theory is more solid than any I've seen. A very good Root. But kunlun has seriously catalyzed everything I've learned from him.
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Postby joeblast » Sat Dec 15, 2007 2:53 pm

I remembered one other thing, something having to do with certain practices are blatantly not compatible with kunlun, i.e. kundalini yoga - if the energy is different enough then supposedly there might be a third harmonic resonance that can be produced from the two that are incompatible and it might be detrimental. So it looks like it was more of a thing of 'we cant give an assessment of every possible form of energy cultivation, so best to stick with only kunlun until you have developed the energy flow enough to where your channels are open enough and you have control over your energy enough to know'
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Postby joeblast » Sun Dec 30, 2007 12:00 pm

Trunk put up a good bit about this on his alchemicaltaoism page:
http://www.precisiondocs.com/~altaoism/kunlun.htm
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Postby joeblast » Wed Jan 23, 2008 3:37 pm

Attended a kunlun seminar this weekend. Energy there was great, we all had a good time, learned a couple complimentary practices to Kunlun 1. Got energy transmissions that made practice more energetic. Saturday was more energetic than sunday for me personally, though it seemed the other way around for everyone else. My knot of tightness in my chest seemed to prevent me from making too much progress with it. Max told me saturday if I can just relax that and let go of it, get it out, then I should be able to fully open kunlun energy with no problem. I was soooo tired from getting up really early, going to bed really late...Sunday was good for a time and then I just hit a brick wall and was sore.
Max did a scorpion palm and eagle claw palm demonstration on me Sunday, that was pretty cool. Everyone in the class cringed, but it felt good...in a somewhat masochistic way :lol:
Energy transmissions were interesting...I expected to feel energy most while there was contact, but I felt it more before, not so much during, then after it was like whoooooooooosh!!!! like taking a finger out of the hole in a dam :lol: I can still feel those points, interestingly...
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Postby Yue » Tue Feb 26, 2008 8:13 am

A note on grand circulation and Kunlun,

I spoke with one of Max Christensen's (aka Lama Dorje's) top students, and he said that merely leading the qi to the limbs for energizing the muslces won't do anything bad to you, it's just the more complex stuff like exchanging your qi with nature and (I think) four gates breathing.
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Postby joeblast » Tue Mar 04, 2008 8:35 am

Kunlun seminar coming up May 3-4, somewhere in NJ - havent seen the location info yet. I'll most likely be there!
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Postby Rafael » Thu Mar 27, 2008 1:43 am

Hi.

Is it possible to receive siginificant results from the practice by following the book alone or is it necessary to attend a seminar as mentiond in the website?

Thanks
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Postby joeblast » Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:14 am

I know a bunch of people that have made a lot of good progress with it without getting the transmission. I made a lot of good progress with it before I got the transmission. Its more knowledge as opposed to energy, though. The transmission definitely helps the practice, no doubts about it.
There's a seminar upcoming in NJ beginning of may and they're heading off to europe after that.


Just got some links from the fellas. First is May 3-4 kunlun seminar at the holiday inn in secaucus NJ. Second link is for a kunlun medicine seminar which will go over how to use kunlun energy for healing.
http://www.regonline.com/kunlunmay3
http://www.regonline.com/kunlunmay4
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Postby styrofoamdog » Thu Apr 17, 2008 12:09 am

I'm sure the Qigong forms work, and may be very effective. But some of the ideas seem like they were taken almost straight from Li Hongzhi and Falun Dafa.

1. A book is sold that teaches an "ancient" cultivation practice never heard of by others previously.
2. The teacher of these methods claims supernatural origins (different from others at birth, unnaturally curious about spiritual teachings at an early age, etc.).
3. For best results, someone naturally must attend a seminar to get a special esoteric energy transmission from the teacher.
4. Energy is not called qi, although it seems to bear a strong resemblence, and the name of it has spiritual or esoteric connotations.
5. The teacher claims that the spiritual energy cultivated by the technique is vastly superior to qigong that traditionally cultivates qi into the dan tian.

Maybe Max Christensen is the real deal. I'd like to believe that he is, but these things just don't add up for me. Most of the success of his methods seems to be related to the relaxation and spontaneity encouraged in the exercise. The spontaneous movements that induce qi flow and clear up the body, are very similar to what Wong Kiew Kit teaches as "self-manifested chi flow".
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Postby joeblast » Thu Apr 17, 2008 10:45 am

A healthy dose of skepticism is always a good thing :)

I've seen plenty enough qigong forms that have similar elements to them, though. From this and other systems I've studied, how you do the stuff and in what progression makes a difference.

Those guys are currently rewriting the book, I think the new version will have more stuff in it.

I dont recall Max ever claiming that the kunlun energy is superior in any way to the traditional notion of qi that is stored in the dantien (kunlun qi is stored there, too.) From what I've seen, there's your general category of qi - but there are different kinds of qi that are qualitatively different within that general category. Of course it is all 'qi' in some sense of the word. I'm sure we've all seen the John Chang videos of him lighting the paper on fire and talking about merging yin qi and yang qi; Max describes the kunlun qi as magnetic in nature, and I've spoke with others that have described the kunlun qi as a ling qi or spiritual qi. Its virtually impossible to convey any qualitative differences here, its an experiential thing. Perhaps if I were that experienced I would be able to convey some subtle impressions, but I am not :)

I'm still not certain as to whether I will continue my kunlun path for the long run; presently I am in a period of contemplation and analysis. I dipped my feet in the foundation training (cousin lineage of Chang's mo pai) and I dig that stuff too, but the sitting meditation for that works on gathering yang qi and forming a dantien with it by means of a certain path...and that path is not compatible with the kunlun path.

That said, I've had awesome experiences with kunlun, and I have met a lot of other people that have had awesome experiences with it as well. As far as best results and attending a seminar...I can liken that to being an amateur guitarist and then getting a front row seat watching Gilmour play...you just walk away with some deeper understandings...
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Postby styrofoamdog » Fri Apr 18, 2008 11:25 am

True, and if the forms work well, then there's no reason not to practice them. I think that some of these things raise questions because people use different paradigms for understanding qigong. It would be nice if we could understand qi better at the physical level, so we could understand the electromagnetic properties of it better. Ultimately, it would be useful to be able to detect it easily, and to understand the differences between different "types" of qi (through wavelengths or other properties).
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